Burnout: A Journey Towards Resilience with Amy Schamberg 1

Imagine being passionate about your career, yet feeling completely drained and disillusioned. That's the reality for many educators facing burnout today. In part 1 of a 6 episode series that will come out over the next 6 months, we sit down with Amy Schamberg, a former school psychologist who redefined her life by becoming a certified functional medicine health coach. Amy shares her deeply personal experience with teacher burnout, offering a historical perspective that traces the issue back to the 70s and 80s. This episode is not just about recognizing burnout, but also about understanding the critical balance between ambition and self-care.

Show notes:

How stressed are YOU? Take the quiz and find out:
https://greatergood.berkeley.edu/quizzes/take_quiz/stress_and_anxiety

Educator Resources from the Greater Good Magazine:
https://greatergood.berkeley.edu/education

Want to know more about Greater Good Magazine or Greater Good Science Center? Go to this link to find out more:
https://greatergood.berkeley.edu/about

Chapters

• 0:12 The Reality of Teacher Burnout
• 5:31 Navigating Chronic Stress and Burnout
• 15:58 Recognizing and Recovering From Burnout
• 19:38 Understanding and Overcoming Teacher Burnout
• 26:06 Navigating Personal Patterns and Boundaries

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:12

Teachers have one of the highest burnout rates out of all occupations and that's why I am super passionate about this as well. The last statistic that I saw said that 52% of educators in the United States are burnt out, and it's been something that's been going on for years. When I first started looking into this, I thought that it was a new thing. However, in my research I found articles from the 70s, from the 80s, talking about teacher burnout. I found an article from 1983. It was a meta-analysis looking at teacher stress and burnout. And then there was an article in the New York Times from 1979 titled Teacher Burnout a Growing Hazard.

Speaker 2: 1:11

So this has been going on for so long. A few years ago, I started writing a fictitious story based on my time as an educator. It is called Taught, and the story was partially inspired out of anger and frustration fueled by burnout. Okay, actually, it was more than partially inspired by anger and frustration. But taught has also become a vehicle for me to tell what I thought at the time and in some ways continue to think was and is the real story of teaching. I now realize that my perspective is not everyone's perspective, but there are some pieces of taught that resonated with many educators. This podcast is an extension of that story and I, a former teacher, will interview other educators, asking them to share how they really feel about the current state of education. Why are so many teachers burnout? Why are so many, like me, leaving the field? We likely won't solve any problems or come up with any solutions, but we can create a community of voices that maybe begin the conversation around how educators can take back teaching. I'm Melissa LaFleur. Welcome to Taught the podcast.

Speaker 2: 2:35

Today I have Amy Schamberg with me. I'm sure you've heard me mention her a few times if you've been listening to the podcast. Amy and I actually met through a series of coincidences and we quickly learned that we have a huge common interest, which is educators that are coping with chronic stress and burnout. Amy earned her graduate degree in school psychology from the University of Colorado and worked as a school psychologist in the Denver metro area for over a decade. Now, as a certified functional medicine health coach, amy continues to work in wellness consultancy roles within educational programs throughout Colorado. She specializes in mental health, burnout recovery and holistic well-being.

Speaker 2: 3:21

Having experienced and recovered from her own episodes of burnout, amy is passionate about helping others build resilience and develop the confidence to prioritize themselves, and we are lucky to have her here. She has generously agreed to come on periodically and share some of her knowledge and strategies around chronic stress and burnout, around chronic stress and burnout. I think that one of the things that strikes me about Amy's story is the fact that she went from this role in education to functional medicine, and I think that if you are in burnout recovery, as many of us are, you find that you have a host of things that your body tells you, so that transition does not surprise me. Amy, I'm so happy you're here. Welcome to the podcast.

Speaker 1: 4:12

Thank you, I'm so excited to be here.

Speaker 2: 4:14

So today we're going to talk about chronic stress and burnout from a professional's point of view. That's you, amy. But before we get there, can you tell us a little bit about your own burnout story? I love that this is a portion of your bio because it feels really vulnerable and experiential to me and personally I need that when I'm talking to people on this topic. So can you tell us your story and what did burnout look like for you?

Speaker 1: 4:43

Yeah, absolutely. And it's interesting because I work with so many deeply caring professionals who are experiencing burnout or are, you know, recovering from it. And we all have the same experience that like when, when you're in the thick of it, you don't even realize it's happening. And so for myself, you know it's. It's one of those things where, if you're a person who, like myself, like if you're very busy, if you're very, like you're multi passionate, if you're ambitious, if you have, like all these projects going on all the time, you know and you feel energized by it, you have to be very mindful of striking a good balance and allowing yourself to have downtime. And I learned that the hard way.

Speaker 1: 5:31

It was several years ago, right before COVID. I had decided that I was going to become a functional medicine health coach. I was already working as a school psychologist. I had been in school psychology for about 10 years. At that point I was working in the largest school, high school in Colorado, so we had at that time about 3,200 students. I had 1,000 kids on my caseload, holy cow, yeah. So, like work itself was crazy busy. But then I was also going through this training program and I was, you know, a mom, like many of us are, and I have a kid with special needs and my husband travels a lot for work, so I was often solo parenting. And then COVID came and so but I decided I was fine and I would just keep pushing through things and continue continuing on. And then it was like early 2021. On, and then it was like early 2021.

Speaker 1: 6:25

And it was right before the school year was to begin, actually in August, I went back to visit my parents and, with my kids, I took my kids with me to go visit my parents. I hadn't seen them since before COVID and I always had a bit of a tricky relationship with my family but normally had some gas in the tank, but I didn't have any gas in the tank that time. So it was really really difficult and it kind of brought me to my knees. And then I came back with my kids and had to start the school year and that's when I realized that something was not right. So I remember sitting in meetings at the start of the year and just not being able to focus or concentrate, like people were talking but I was hearing like the womp, womp, womp, you know. And then kids started coming into my office and I just was lacking a lot of compassion and for a while I thought maybe I was experiencing compassion fatigue.

Speaker 1: 7:24

But then when I really noticed that I was just having this complete like, detachment, like, and this feeling that like, no matter what I could do or what I did, I would never get ahead, that's when I was like oh my God, amy, this is burnout. You are absolutely, utterly burnt out. I was completely exhausted. I can remember waking up in the morning. My alarm would go off and I would literally look at the time and calculate, okay, how many hours until I can go back to bed, before I even got out of bed and it was really hard and I did that. I kind of like lived like that for a while.

Speaker 1: 8:02

And then I think the icing on the cake or like the moment where I was like, okay, I need to do something to help myself get better, was a few weeks into the school year. It was like a Wednesday and I had just completed I think it was like my fourth or fifth suicide risk assessment of that week, which is not uncommon in a school of the size that I was in. But rather than feeling like empathy or compassion or concern, I felt irritated. I was like irritated that this took up so much of my time because I needed to go test a kid and I needed to write an IEP, and like I had all these thoughts flooding in and then I was like whoa, wait a minute, that is not normal. That is not a normal reaction to be irritated that a child is hurting themselves, and that was really scary for me, because that's not who I am as a person. And so that's when I finally talked to my therapist and we decided that I should take some time off, and so I ended up taking a 10 week leave of absence to kind of put myself back together.

Speaker 1: 9:12

However and we can get into this too but the funny thing is, as I spent the first eight weeks of my leave just doing the same thing I had been doing, but in a different way.

Speaker 1: 9:22

So I was like piling on the self-care, I was keeping myself busy.

Speaker 1: 9:25

I was dropping my kids off at school, and then I was going to go to like therapy appointment, or I was going to go to acupuncture, and then I would go to yoga, and then I'd take a walk in nature, and then I'd read a self-help book and organize my kitchen and do all these things and then pick the kids up from. It was two weeks before I was supposed to go back and I realized I was just as raw and depleted and exhausted as I had been at the start of that time off. And that's when I really realized that, okay, there's something else going on that's perpetuating my burnout. It's not just the difficult family relationship that I mentioned, it's not just the you know huge caseload at work, it's not these other external things, it's some internal things, and I had to take a real hard look at myself to understand what those things were, what those habits and patterns and faulty beliefs were, so that I could start to shift those. And that's when the real recovery finally started to begin.

Speaker 2: 10:21

And I have a feeling that that's where you're going to lead us today, because this sounds very similar to my own journey that I thought if I just could move to Portugal and stop teaching that I would be fine. Then and it took six months of me making sourdough bread, I could have started my own bakery. I had five different starters. At one point I had all kinds of plant seedlings everywhere that I was killing sporadically, and I was making kombucha and volunteering at the animal shelter here. I didn't even speak Portuguese. I was cleaning dog poop all the time and I thought I am no happier. I am no happier now. I am no more relaxed than I should be in a classroom. I should still be. Just if that was not it. That was not the thing.

Speaker 2: 11:15

So, that's a really full circle challenging moment. And you hit on something else that I think I felt and I feel a little bit in your story as well which is I felt guilty for being burnout, absolutely Like I should be able to do all these things that I feel like I should be doing. Yep.

Speaker 1: 11:34

A hundred percent. Yeah, that guilt and that shame is really strong.

Speaker 2: 11:41

So is there a difference? Because I I kind of feel like there must be, or we wouldn't have two terms for it. But I hear about chronic stress and I hear about burnout and, to be honest with you, I actually feel like we throw these terms around kind of loosey, goosey, um, for a variety of different things. But, um, I got to tell you, if I had to tell my own story and figure out where one crossed into the other, I don't really think I could.

Speaker 2: 12:15

I felt like day after day, I was climbing a mountain and at the beginning I was hopeful I would actually get to the top and somewhere on the climb I accepted that this was just life, I was going to be on this climb and I wasn't probably going to get to the top. And then one day something shifted and I knew I didn't want to die on the mountain and I spent every day after that desperately trying to figure out how to get off the mountain. And that's when I realized I was burnt out because I could not see a way out, like I said, realized I was burnout because I could not see a way out, like I said, like my way out was to quit my job and move to another country. So is there a difference between chronic stress and burnout, or are we just calling you know? Are we just are there? Are these synonyms for the same thing?

Speaker 1: 13:06

Yeah, no, I love that you asked that question because I do feel that the words kind of get thrown around a lot and it is important to understand the distinction. And I think I would even back up one more step before that and talk about the difference between acute stress and chronic stress, you know, and the difference between a stressor versus the stress response that we have. So you know, stress is a normal part of life and we are meant to experience stress. So that stress used to be the stress of, you know, being chased by a bear, you know, in the woods, or perhaps, like you know, the stress of are we going to find the food for hunters and gatherers. And now our stressors are things like deadlines and traffic jams and, you know, naughty children and kids not following directions and all these other things. But it doesn't really matter what the trigger is or what the stressor is, because the response that we have in our body is the same. So, whether we're getting chased by a bear or, you know, we're having a fight with our spouse, or you know, we just have a lot of rumination happening inside of our heads, we have the same sort of physiological response. It's this cascade of hormones that leads to, you know, the release of cortisol and the release of adrenaline and that's what kind of puts us in that fight or flight state that we're quite familiar with. And then the difference between acute stress and chronic stress if it's an acute stressor, once that stress, that trigger is gone, we come back down, we come out of that high hormonal level of cortisol and adrenaline, we come back to homeostasis and we feel good again and that's OK, and that's resilience, and we can do that, you know, over and over again. We're meant to do that, that's OK. Chronic stress is when our level of homeostasis is elevated and our levels of cortisol and adrenaline are just the baseline, is so much higher and we become just baseline fight or flight, and that's a real problem because that's when we can start to experience some physical effects as well.

Speaker 1: 15:08

But you know, if you're wondering like am I chronically stressed? How do I know if I am? Typically you would be experiencing three to five symptoms for a period of, you know, two to three weeks. So aches and pains, or insomnia, or exhaustion, low energy, a change in appetite. So either just, you know, eating too much or not having an appetite at all, having cloudy thinking, being more irritable than usual, having really big reactions to, you know, normal day-to-day issues, or emotionally withdrawing, and these are all things that we experience. But I'm saying, if we are experiencing multiple of those symptoms over a period of several weeks, that's when you know you're chronically stressed.

Speaker 1: 15:58

And then when does stress become burnout? You know there are three types of characteristics that kind of explain what burnout is, and the World Health Organization actually defines burnout as an occupational phenomenon that is perpetuated by unmanaged, ongoing chronic stress. Okay, so you're dealing with the chronic stress that I described. It's been multiple weeks, you're having multiple symptoms and then, on top of that, you feel a sense of detachment. So you just kind of feel detached from what you're doing.

Speaker 1: 16:30

You feel this sense of, um, personal inefficacy. So, like I said before, that sense of no matter what you do, you can never get ahead. Like it doesn't even matter how hard I try the work, the load is so high like I can't do anything about it. Um, and then this, this sense of like negativity or cynicism, right, just having kind of a negative outlook on things and some examples of what it might look like or feel like to experience burnout.

Speaker 1: 16:57

You know, you feel like every single day is a bad day and you feel like nothing that you do is appreciated. You have trouble telling one day from the next. You feel disconnected from your work, like it doesn't really matter anymore, because you feel that lack of efficacy. Your performance starts dropping because you stop trying as hard, because it's like why should I try? It doesn't even matter. You feel exhausted, hard to concentrate and then, along with that negativity or cynicism, you might notice that you don't feel like or you don't see the humor in things anymore. Right, like you used to be able to kind of laugh at things or even have a sick sense of humor about things. But if we can't even laugh at like the dysfunction, like if the humor is lost, then that's another big sign that you're experiencing burnout.

Speaker 2: 17:46

As you are going through this list, I am thinking first of all, did she have a hidden camera? My last five years of teaching. The second thing that goes through my head is how many educators I know I personally worked with and this is not unique to education. I want to pause there. This is not unique to education.

Speaker 2: 18:06

Anybody can experience burnout, but I did make a note there that, according to the definition, it is occupational, so that can be a variety of different occupations, correct? Yes, so, but for our purposes, we think about education, since that's the wheelhouse that I did this podcast, and it's about, specifically about, educator burnout, and I know for a fact what you're saying, man. That was at least 50% of my colleagues that sense of things are not going to get better and that caused us to get into these loops and discussions that had no resolution. After your explanation, I can see how I gave that mountain analogy. I can see where I was slowly losing my self-efficacy and that I entered into that negative zone. So once you realize you're there, which may take a while, right, is it possible to come back and what do you recommend for people who find themselves there?

Speaker 1: 19:22

The answer is 100%. Yes, it's not all doom and gloom, and I do want to come back to the piece about teacher burnout and just share that teachers have one of the highest burnout rates out of all occupations and that's why I am super passionate about this as well. The last statistic that I saw said that 52% of educators in the United States are burnt out and it's been something that's been going on for years. It's been something that's been going on for years. When I first started looking into this, I thought that it was a new thing. However, in my research, I found articles from the 70s, from the 80s, talking about teacher burnout. I found an article from 1983. It was a meta-analysis looking at teacher stress and burnout. And then there was an article in the New York Times from 1979 titled Teacher Burnout a Growing Hazard. So this has been going on for so long and I just I don't know. I just I'm very passionate about it.

Speaker 1: 20:23

And so, yes, people are burnt out from many occupations. I even see people burn out from being a caregiver right or a parent or burnout relationship. So even see people burn out from being a caregiver right or a parent or burnout relationship. So, even though that's the World Health Organization definition. Is that occupational phenomenon? I see it across like all things, but especially if you have a teacher or educator who also happens to be a parent, who also happens to be, you know, a caregiver or perhaps dealing with a difficult relationship, then it just compounds, which is many, which is most, not even many.

Speaker 2: 20:56

It's most right A hundred percent.

Speaker 1: 20:59

Yeah, so anyway, I just wanted to put that out there.

Speaker 2: 21:02

No, I appreciate that, because I think that this is something we don't talk about enough and it feels. It felt like I had to put a disclaimer on here because I say a bunch of stuff that maybe is me, maybe isn't everybody's opinion, but I believe it, and I believe that there's this secrecy around it as well, that and we can talk about this in a future podcast. But I think there are people who are drawn to more altruistic jobs where we are helping others and feel like we're doing it for the greater good. I have some personality traits that kind of make us stay in that burnout space, but again, that's a topic for another time. So how do we come back from this? What are some action steps? I guess it would probably starts when we realize we're in chronic stress. I don't know.

Speaker 1: 22:00

Yeah. So, as with anything, the first step is self-awareness, right? So we need to know that we are experiencing this and there are a bunch of free assessments online. So if you're wondering, like, am I burnt out? I don't know, I wonder if I'm burnt out. I think I'm burnt out, but am I burnt out? You can just Google, you know, burnout, self-assessment, and a bunch will come up and you'll probably take one and say, yes, look at that, I am 100% burnt out. Okay, great, what's the next step? The next step, honestly, is self-compassion. And so I do workshops around the Denver area and I go in and I talk about this kind of stuff and what is chronic stress, what is burnout, what to do next. And every time I say self-compassion, I get about half the people in the room roll their eyes at me and I get it. But it's super important, because beating yourself up about this is not going to make it any better.

Speaker 2: 22:56

Well, that goes back to that shame thing we were talking about. You know, we feel the guilt, but that immediately goes into shame, right? And then it's like nope, not me. Yes.

Speaker 1: 23:05

Yes, and I'm not sure if anyone here has ever read the greater good magazine out of Berkeley, um, the. It's called greater goodberkeleyedu. They have a bunch of great articles, but they wrote an article um not too long ago titled how self-compassion can help prevent teacher burnout, and I can share that with you.

Speaker 2: 23:24

If you want I'll put a link to the, to their stuff in this episode. Yeah, yeah, but really so much good stuff on there.

Speaker 1: 23:31

Yeah, yeah. So self-compassion really has three components. So self-compassion, the first component is called mindfulness, then it's common humanity and self-kindness, and I can walk through those three steps. So mindfulness is essentially just like I said before, that self-awareness, just nonjudgmental awareness and acknowledgement of your experience. Like whoa, I am burnt out. This situation is really hard, this sucks, like you know. And then the next part is common humanity, and common humanity just really means remembering that we're not alone, that we're not the only one that feels imperfect here or that feels guilty about being, you know, burnt out or however. We feel so many times.

Speaker 1: 24:16

I've seen this time and time again when a person, when an educator, when a deeply caring person, is feeling like they don't have the ability to do their job in the way that they know they can because of all of these other things going on, they feel really isolated and they feel like no one else is experiencing this, and so it's super important. A part of self-compassion is remembering, reminding yourself that everybody struggles and that you're not alone and suffering is a part of life and we can get through it. So mindfulness, so that's that nonjudgmental awareness. Common humanity, reminding yourself that others are going through this as well. And then self-kindness, so refraining from criticizing yourself and instead speaking to yourself in the same way you would speak to a good friend. So if you had a good friend that came to you and said, oh my gosh, Melissa, I am so burnt out right now I don't even want to, like go to school tomorrow and I feel like nothing I do matters, no one cares, it's not appreciated. What would you say to that friend?

Speaker 2: 25:25

Yeah, I would, I would. I'm all about taking a day off, a mental health day, but I would say, yeah, let's talk more about this, let's take some time. But to your point, to myself, I would say suck it up, suck it up and do it, thank you.

Speaker 1: 25:40

I was hoping you would say that, right, so we've got to turn that talk that we would say to our friend inward. So that is really the first step, is just showing ourselves some compassion, and it could be helpful to remind yourself, like when I've told myself to pull myself up on my bootstraps and get through it. How's that working for me? Like, how's that working? It's not working very well, right. Another strategy that I find really effective, too, because I've noticed that a lot of us, myself included, are, you know, natural perfectionists or people pleasers, and we don't. We don't want to rock the boat, we don't want to cause any conflict. So we say things like for me it was reports, because I was a psychologist Right Like I have to get these reports done tonight or else the world's going to end, essentially. Or I have a friend who's like I have to get four hours of grading done tonight, but do you really have to? Do you have to? Will someone die if you don't?

Speaker 2: 26:42

That's a very good point. Yeah, nobody's ever died over a report not getting done, especially in a school setting like negative thought spirals too, and we tell ourselves these stories.

Speaker 1: 27:08

But, honestly, the few times where I wasn't able to get a project done, whether it was in the school or otherwise, if I was honest and upfront and said to this person like, hey, by the way, I wasn't able to do X, y, z because of ABC, but I'm, you know, working on it now and I've really not experienced anyone being super like angry or rude, and and the few times that they have, it's kind of like well, that's your problem, not mine, because you know.

Speaker 2: 27:33

Yeah, you're right. I mean, actually I think mine was. I had to teach myself how to take a pause because my immediate reaction, you know, if my friend came to me and said I'm feeling really burnt out you heard me, I actually said it my immediate reaction is how can I help? And I think that was my big phrase in the work setting was I can help you with that.

Speaker 2: 27:59

And so I had to teach myself. I actually have a little callus on the inside of my lip where I bite the inside of my lip. Now I have to force myself to pause, otherwise I will say how can I help with that? And it comes from a genuine place, and the receiver oftentimes takes it as oh, thank goodness, there's somebody to help me, and I love that feeling. What I don't love is taking time for me and my family to help somebody else when I have my own stuff I should be attending to, and so then I'm not a good helper.

Speaker 2: 28:36

And it took many years. Actually, I'm still in recovery, so being honest.

Speaker 1: 28:43

You're not alone. I have a client that I work with right now who's working on that very thing, that very thing. She's a social, a school social worker, but I mean, that's just her. Her nature too is just to say, or kind of jump into like fix it mode and and you know you have the, the knowledge and you know that you can help someone it feels even more, you feel more compelled to do so, but then of course it depletes your energy and it takes the time away from your obligations and responsibilities. So, yeah, that's very common and, honestly, the thing about this like what is the way to fix burnout? There's not one answer.

Speaker 1: 29:21

And going back to you know I was trained to become a functional medicine health coach and for those who aren't familiar with functional medicine, it's really a holistic, root cause approach to looking at all sorts of illnesses, disease, you know, from mental health problems to, you know, heart disease, and it's like getting to the root cause and peeling back the layers and like what's really underneath there, what's really causing this. It's I often explain it like so if you had a headache, the traditional response or the traditional approach would be okay, go take two Advil and your headache goes away. But the functional medicine approach is well, let's figure out why you're you have a headache, you know. Are you dehydrated, you know? Have you not eaten today? Do you have a tumor, like you know. Like let's find out what the actual reason is before we just throw some Advil at it. And that's kind of the same thing.

Speaker 1: 30:13

I find working with burnout is like we've got to kind of peel back those layers, and so it can be really helpful to just kind of get really curious and ask yourself, like, are there any patterns that I can see within myself that may be contributing to this?

Speaker 1: 30:32

Of course there are external factors, like I want everyone to understand. Like, yes, if you are in a toxic work environment, when people are treating you poorly, if you're not being respected, if you have, you know, insane demands being put upon you, you know insane demands being put upon you. But, like, for me, all that was happening, but I was like a huge avoider of conflict, like I did not want to say no because I didn't want there to be any sort of like friction, right, and that was like something that I had to figure out. I also was really uncomfortable with like downtime, because I just knew that there was all this other stuff I could be doing, should be doing the to-do list never ended, so to just like take an actual break, I wouldn't even allow myself to entertain that thought, and so it's really kind of getting deep into who we are as a person and if there's anything that we might be able to shift within ourselves, and that takes some time but it's doable, it really does.

Speaker 2: 31:30

I like that. You mentioned seeing patterns too. I've been fortunate enough to change my circumstances several times. I actually worked in three different school districts and multiple different schools, and so I had a chance to we'll call it reflect reflect on my patterns. And then when I saw some of those same patterns, so I identified it as being a school issue, an education issue, and so then I was. When I saw those same things beginning to come up on my world travels, I realized that, yeah. So I'm really thankful that you mentioned that we have a lot more to actually say on this topic, but we're going to save that for another time.

Speaker 2: 32:18

Now Amy and I have an exciting announcement. Amy is going to be providing a way to continue any conversation that needs to be continued in this podcast or otherwise, around education, burnout, chronic stress, in an online professional group therapy session. These sessions will start on Sunday, july 21st, and they will be at 10 am Pacific Standard Time, 11 am, and they will be at 10 am Pacific Standard Time, 11 am Mountain Time, 12 pm Central Standard Time, 1 pm Eastern Standard Time and 6 pm Portugal Time. For $20, you can get an hour with an experienced professional and avoid the forms, insurance and all that other minutiae that honestly keep many of us from seeking out professional guidance At least they do me. There's no commitment to do more than that. You can find the link to the first session and the subsequent sessions at Amy's website, amyschamburgcom, my website, totbuzzsproutcom, in today's show notes, on Instagram at Amy Schamberg or at taught the podcast, and finally on my Facebook page taught by a teacher. So if you are feeling the burn of burnout and would like some professional guidance on coping strategies, a safe space to speak your truth or maybe just to see if guidance from a professional might be a good step for you, visit the link at any of the locations and sign up. Space for each workshop is limited, so sign up soon.

Speaker 2: 34:04

Today's episode was produced and edited by me. The theme music is by otis mcdonald featuring joni inez. If you know someone who might enjoy these conversations, please share the podcast episodes as much and as often as you can. It's as simple as copying the link you use to access today's episode and sending it in a message or sharing it on social media. I'm a small, independent operation and your shares broaden our audience. Perhaps you or someone you know will be inspired to talk about teacher burnout. If you would like to get your voice on my podcast, contact me via the link on my webpage taughtbuzzsproutcom.

Speaker 2: 35:11

Coach speaker. Thank you, the podcast. I have an important reminder slash disclaimer to share. The views, thoughts and opinions expressed by the hosts and guests on this podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer or company. Content provided on this podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be taken as professional advice. We encourage you to do your own research and consult with qualified professionals before making any decisions based on the information discussed in this or any other episode. Additionally, any opinions or statements made during the podcast are not intended to malign any religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company or individual Listener. Discretion is advised. Thank you for tuning in.